Interview › Kevin Mooney › 2001

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1980Teenage bassist Kevin Mooney has earned himself cult hero status amongst every rebellious young Ants fan over the years. In 2001, after twenty years of virtual silence regarding his time during the exciting and controversial Kings of the Wild Frontier period, Antpeople everywhere were invited to grill the so-called "bad boy" of Antmusic about his life, loves, "highs" and lows of being with the biggest band on the planet!

Give us a brief pre-Ants bio Kevin!
I was brought up in southeast London, Greenwich, with half-English half-Irish parents, and got into punk rock when I was 13 or 14, I was running around and knew all about Adam and Marco and stuff before I'd ever been in a band. Then when Malcolm stole the band, that's when I joined. I was in a couple of little bands, one was called European Cowboys and we rehearsed in a place called Mayhem in Battersea, where the Ants used to rehearse from time to time. There was this girl named Toyah, she used to run it.

Not the Toyah?
Yes, it was her place. A lot of bands used to go there, The Ants, Iggy Pop, Siouxsie & the Banshees, and that was the first time I saw Adam. I must have only been about 15 or something like that. I think I joined [the Ants] when I was 17.

Which bands did you follow as a fan?
I used to like the Clash, the Sex Pistols, Siouxsie and the Banshees, Heartbreakers. I suppose the Damned, Generation X, Subway Sect, The Slits...

Kevin Mooney - Sex Pistols boat trip 1977When punk started getting commercial, did you tune out of the punk scene then?
Yeah. I don't think punk lasted long, just a couple of years really. It wasn't exactly elite, but it went from being a really small thing, then all of a sudden it became really big. I suppose that's why the Sex Pistols lasted two years, and the Rolling Stones lasted thirty years or whatever. It was all too quick for them.

What would you say was the last year for punk?

Then what did you get into?
I started getting into Kraftwerk and stuff like that, and going down to Blitz. I wasn't really into the New Romantic scene but I was quite into the gay scene after punk because it was still quite interesting. And during into the 80s as well I was into that scene because most clubs in London in the 80s were shit. You could go to gay places, not everybody there was gay but it was a much more interesting scene.

Tell us how you joined the band, and what happened in Eve's flat?
I was going out with Eve, who was married to Adam at one point. She was in a band called Tra-la-la, a punk band with two other girls. Adam came round to visit her one day, I happened to be playing the bass and he needed a bass player quick. He was a bit desperate really, so they gave me a go. It was a bit of luck really!

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1980And you were playing No Lip?
No Lip, yeah. I could play the bass before I joined the band but I was more into reggae.

So did he call you into an audition?
Yeah. I think we went up to Tootsies and then he told me the whole story that I didn't really know, about Malcolm, his ideas and how Malcolm was a horrible bastard because he nicked Adam's band and how Adam was going to beat him to it. He was going to take all the ideas and beat Bow Wow Wow to the charts, and he did.

And that was his 'mission statement'?
Yeah - that was his mission right then. We stayed there a while and a couple of days later we were rehearsing.

Was Adam convinced that Adam & the Ants were going to be a household name?
He was. I suppose right so because he'd seen every other band including the Banshees, seen them come through, and there was Adam & the Ants still in punk rock, dying off in a way. He thought, "Well how come I haven't made it?” It was his burning ambition.

Did feel you were part of something new and exciting music-wise?
Yes, definitely. I remember when we were doing the Kings album, we hadn't even finished the album, and the C30 C60 C90 Go! [Bow Wow Wow] song came on the television. We were all pretty nervous at that point because it was on Saturday morning TV and everybody in the band thought that they'd won. But it was only a few weeks later when CBS brought Kings out and it turned out it wasn't so bad.

How did the band react to the Kings single not making the top forty, when it was such an innovative track?
We were pissed off because we thought we'd lost. But then a few weeks later it went back in!

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1980Bow Wow Wow's single flopped I think...
But their version was out first. That was really exciting...

What made you different from Bow Wow Wow?
When I heard their album I actually thought it was better. But I think Adam just did it more heartfelt. A lot of the same beats but when you've got Marco on it, it's just completely different anyway.

Do you think it helped that Adam was a man, a heartthrob?
Not necessarily, no. But I think Adam really meant it. Malcolm had his intellectual idea and put Bow Wow Wow together, but Adam did the Ants really heart-felt, with a passion.

How do you think the fans reacted to the new line-up?
They were fine. I remember the first gig I did, I had never gone on stage before. At the Electric Ballroom in Camden, there were two thousand people there - it was packed. I remember going on stage and there was a heat coming off the Ant fans, they weren't complaining. I wasn't the greatest bass player, I'm sure I made a few fuck-ups, but I tried my best. And they seemed happy. A few months later they did turn, which was more or less the same point that I turned. But for six or eight months at least it was fucking great.

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1980When you were being featured more in the media?
We had a lot of media, but it got a bit much around the time I left which was the Royal Variety performance for Princess Margaret, that was the last thing. A couple of weeks before then a lot of the original fans, who had followed the band through two tours or more, they started throwing rocks at our bus. It just went too commercial, in my opinion. Commercial in the wrong direction. I said, "I don't wanna do this Royal Variety thing, we should be playing in New York." But he really wanted this English showbiz thing, he was really into that. Not that I'm against that, but I want to be in a rock band!

Because in similarities of on stage attitude, some early fans wanted to know whether Matthew Ashman was a hero for you, despite playing different instruments?
Not really, I barely knew him then. I saw the earlier versions of Adam & the Ants with Johnny Bivouac and Jordan, but I hadn't really followed it much. But a few years later I ended up being in a band with Matthew. I think Matthew's a wicked player.

How did you feel about wearing make-up?
I didn't care. We used to think of it as war paint. But it did get really camp I think in a naff way, but I was into the idea off putting on a little make-up.

Looking at photos you seemed to have a lot more than anyone else!
Sometimes, yeah.

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1980You had smears across the face...
Only one time, and that was a bit of bitchiness on my part, and Jordan's - because at the Royal Variety performance that was going to be Adam's next look apparently. Jordan was trying to piss him off by using that. But I don't think I wore a lot of make-up. We used to look at pictures of Red Indians before we went on stage, and try and put on more make-up. But Adam had it more together with just a straight line.

There's some interesting photos we dug where you've put eyeliner down the side of your nose...
Yeah, but if you want to see some really fucking stupid make-up, take a look at Wide Boy Awake videos! The same thing happened to us. I'm like 'Mr Revolutionary', I go away from Adam & the Ants and write a bunch of songs thinking these are going to be good, but I ended up through RCA putting out music that was even more trivial, more commercialised. That's unfortunately what a lot of record companies do. This is stuff you can do about it, but most of the time they have the game sorted out. People's image that gets sent out... people think they are in control of it, but they're not.

Adam liked to say that he was artistically in control...
He was very good at that. I saw some of his old posters recently, he put that together really well, he was good at that.

Terry Lee Miall once told us that there was a time where you recorded a bass line down at Rockfield, Adam came in and re-recorded it, then when Adam went to lunch they put you back on, is that true?
Yes, that is true.

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1980Did you find that was happening regularly?
I didn't mind, he [Adam] wrote the songs. I wasn't the greatest bass player in the world at that time. I'd say I only played on about five songs.

Can you remember what they were?

Did you play on Antmusic?
Yes, I think that may be the one you were talking about. I remember that because Chris was complaining about it because he said that the bass line I did was good, and Adam had a slightly different one, but Adam was alright about that.

We interviewed Chris Constantinou last week and he said Antmusic is his favourite bass line, so that's nice to know!
I think Kings is a good bass line, I really like the bass on that.

What do you think of Adam's bass playing?
He's a really great bass player, very good, yeah. He played… [hums Tabletalk] Tabletalk, that's the one! That was a wicked bass line, he wrote that, yeah. He's a really good bass player.

What do you think are the strengths and weaknesses of Kings on the whole?
It's alright. I think Jolly Roger and a couple of other are maybe a little bit... [makes face] but I like Kings of the Wild Frontier, it's good. I like Dirk Wears White Sox.

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1980Which one do you prefer?

Tell us how the first Top of the Pops appearance went. Did you tell your mother?
Yes, I told my Mum and Dad. I used to watch Top of the Pops. It was good, it was like going onto Doctor Who or something. You see it on TV and you have a certain image of it, then when you're actually there it looks really small, and it's made out of silver paper and stuff! It was fun.

Adam has an interesting version of events of what happened after the Top of the Pops filming, with the fight with 4Be2s. What do you remember of the event?
I remember that they started on Mandy, Adam and Marco, and then Jordan and I came down the stairs. There was a big fight, and that little fucking arsehole, Jock McDonald, I jumped on him and started having a go at him. There were about ten other people. I tell you, that 4be2 lot are a bunch of fucking wankers. No doubt they still are, you know, drunk 'round Finsbury Park. They were arseholes. And I tell you what, the most annoying thing was I beat Jock McDonald in that fight, but someone broke my bass. And that pissed me off because that was a really good bass. It was a Gibson, and I'd never had one like that before or since.

So you couldn't get it fixed?
No. I tried to get another one but it wasn't the same.

So it was actually a proper fight? Adam claims he was almost stabbed and Mandy saved him...
Yeah, he was going on about all that and Jordan was quite feisty in that one, and there was an Antfan with a mohican. I used to talk to him a lot but I never knew his name, he was there.

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1981Did that used to happen a lot?
Yeah, and I was surprised because that happened right in the middle of the BBC. We were walking back, getting ready to go out and then these fucking arseholes jumped us. I wouldn't mind, but they never made a good fucking record in their life! Fair enough if it was Johnny Rotten or something, but it was Johnny Rotten's wanker brother.

So why were they there?
Fuck knows.

So things like that did happen?
Oh yeah, a lot of that happened. We had some very strange violent scenes.

By Ant fans?
Road crew turning on the band! We had a fellow working for us who was a professional security guy who had to fight the road crew - a guy from the paratroops regiment! A lot of nice things happened too, but there was quite a bit of violence.

Another thing Terry said was that the band would avoid going to Ireland because you were scared…
Who me?!

The band were scared because you were Irish...
I'm very Republican. But I tell you what, I don't want to fucking blow no one up in the middle of a shopping centre in Manchester. At the same time I think fair play to the Unionists, fair play to everybody, the English and the Irish. But that war should be over, and people that have been saying that, on the Republican side, I totally agree with them. I think David Trimble was smart to do that. It's a war that should have been over years ago. Now's the time to end it. Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1981I grew up with a lot of Irish people, a lot of English people and I love 'em both. Now's the time to let it be and everybody should just get along in peace.

Somebody wanted to know what that fluffy thing on your shoulder was in the Kings video..!
That was some kind of feather, Eve got it! It's a pirate thing!

So when did you realise the Ants had made it big? After the first tour?
Yeah... it was exciting!

Because you were young at the time, and apparently you got a lot of fan mail, how did you cope with the adulation?
I wasn't adulated. But it was a bit weird going to McDonalds to get a burger and people, you know, talk to you and stuff!

Did you see yourself as being the cutest Ant?
Not particularly, no. I saw myself as the disgruntled Ant. I looked up to Adam and Marco as big brothers in a way, and the longer I was in the band... I was too hardcore in my own punky world. I believed in all that shit, and I ended up not being the cute Ant but the disgruntled Ant who didn't want to be there.

Did you see yourself as a bad boy?
No. But I think generally that if someone wants to fuck with me then they've made a big mistake. That's not saying bad things about any person anywhere, but if you want to give me some trouble then I'm going to give you some fucking trouble back. I'd apply that to Adam or anyone else. But at the same time I'd much rather just have everything nice - I'm not a troublemaker!

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1981You always looked like you had that attitude, when you were playing you looked so intense!
I probably took it too seriously, I'm a little bit older and wiser now, but in a way I still do, in certain ways.

Did you think popularity would have been a problem to Adam?
We finished that thing with bad blood, and then a row over Jordan, because Adam and Jordan were very close, but they weren't going out with each other. I started going out with Jordan, and that caused more friction. I had a bit of an attitude because I was saying what we were doing was not very punk rock. I was saying it wasn't very cool, but he was saying "This is showbiz, you can't be stupid". Now, that led to a clash between him and me. I can see how he'd turn that way because he'd been fighting for so fucking long, three or four years, he'd seen a lot of his peers go through and his success came at a very strange time.

How did the band get on as a whole?
We weren't all that close, but we were quite close. When it came down to doing a gig, if one did go well then we felt really fucking good, it was nice. But once a tour comes to an end... that's the weirdest thing that's ever happened to me. The end of the first Adam and the Ants tour was really strange, because it's like, "We're not playing tomorrow, what do we do now?".

Did you feel a change in atmosphere as you were going along?
I just wasn't that into it. There was a bad atmosphere at the end but I was talking to Marco again after six months, and I've seen Marco on and off over the years. I haven't seen Adam lately, the last time was about ten years ago before I left England. Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1981I used to see Adam occasionally then. I haven't spoken to Chris or Terry. There's no reason for that, I just haven't had their numbers.

The band started to become more family friendly when you left; do you think the aggression petered out?
It's not just Adam & the Ants, but the whole punk movement was really great. What came after it in the 80's was awful. I think it got better towards the end of the 80's when the technology started picking up. Apart from a bit of hip-hop and a bit of reggae, there wasn't that much that was good in the 80s.

Was there a particular moment where you thought you'd had enough of it?
I can't remember. I did enjoy touring with the band. We had a few problems here and there...

And nobody else shared your concerns?
Terry didn't give a fuck, Chris was a hippy anyway, Marco and Adam were a unit... I was glad to leave the band and I'm sure they were glad for me to be gone! No hard feelings.

Do you think the Ants were pandering music industry marketing and corporate strategy?
I think Adam gave CBS a lot of ideas. He was quite hot on video at that time. That sounds silly now, but at the time it was leading-edge technology and he was really up on that. And with his graphics... I don't think he sat around waiting for CBS to come up with ideas - because it would never happen. He did it all himself. I think he created a lot of, unfortunately a bit naff, but very successful, packaging of the 1980s. He was quite responsible.

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1981Setting the tone for the 80s..?
I think so, yeah.

Can you give us your version of events for your last appearance with the Ants - the Children's Royal Variety Performance?
Bad atmosphere even beforehand. I think maybe Don Murfet or someone had it rigged so that my bass strap would break. I was in a shitty mood, and I don't think I was ever gonna play with those guys again anyway, even before that happened. I don't know if they wanted to make me look stupid or something. I think one of the roadies made it so that my strap broke. So I felt... that happened so I thought, "fucking hell, I don't give a shit!" so I threw my bass on the ground and started jumping around and not miming. Just generally fucking it up.

The camera seemed to like you anyway!
I just thought, "I've had enough Adam, this is the end for me, you can carry on and do what you want". So it was a little revenge job in a way. But I'm sure it looked good for him.

It's a fantastic performance anyway, it did look good.
That's all well and good.

Can you remember what Adam said to you towards the end?

I think Terry said he tried to say "pick it up"

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1981Did you feel like punching Adam, or did Adam feel like punching you?
No, he wouldn't have done.

And when the curtains went down...
I can't even remember. I think I stayed for a while because I think I met Princess Margaret, she seemed quite nice. I'm not a big fan of the Royal Family, I'm not against them, but I don't support them...

Do you think you were sacked? Were you pushed or did you jump?
Both, they were going to fire me away, but I wasn't sticking around so...

Were you already aware of Stand & Deliver?
Yeah, I think I played on a demo of it.

How did you feel when you saw Stand & Deliver? Did you see the video?
Look, more power to him for doing well right, I ain't against the fella. I mean, fine. But I just felt a bit disappointed by all that stuff, because I do think Adam has a really good catalogue of songs but the whole era we grew up in. There were certain things worth maintaining in the punk rock lifestyle right, and I don't think Adam & the Ants did that. But at the same time, if you look at the early songs, Adam's written a shit-load of good songs, nobody can deny that. But I wouldn't have been in that band for ten seconds longer than I was.

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1981It was a good thing to go out on, wasn't it?
Yeah, it was fine. Nice one. We'd done some good fucking things and we'd had some right good laughs too.

I think all the kids at school were talking about it the next day
Yeah, why not. I wasn't media-savvy at the time. I just thought, "right, I've done this, learnt a couple of things out of it, got paid for it, now it's up to me to carry on" so I wasn't thinking too much about their next move. I didn't know what the future would hold after that, so I just kept going. It is a weird experience going from southeast London to... you're 18, earning tons of fucking money, you can do what the fuck you want, eat your dinner off a gold plate if you want. It is weird and that money goes fucking quick. I've learnt now. I did live a lot of excess off Adam & the Ants. With Jordan, what we were about was debauchery and that's exactly what we fucking did. And I'm glad!

Gets it out of you system?
Yeah, gets it out of your system. Now, I'm not the same person, I'm fairly sensible when it comes to money. I do know how to look after money to a certain degree.

If you had hung on in there...
It was beyond that…

…Do you think the Ants would have stayed together?
Probably not.

Kevin Mooney - Adam & the Ants 1981How did you rate Gary Tibbs?
To tell you the truth, I didn't pay any attention. I don't wanna rain on Adam's parade on anything, but I thought Ant Rap was fucking stupid, right, that was my opinion at the time. Now, I don't care one way or another. But I wasn't looking over my shoulder to see what Adam & the Ants were doing. I was glad to be out of the band.

So, when you saw Ant Rap and Prince Charming you thought, "thank fuck I'm out of that"?
Yeah. A little disappointed because I know Adam is a smart guy, I know he is, and I expected more of him.

You thought he was a degrading himself in a way?
Well, it's not his fault either. Adam did become popular at a very strange time in pop music, right at the start of MTV, right at the start of the video age. And I think the experiment went a little bit astray, but that's not necessarily his fault, things just happened. To water it down, just to pop, I thought that was a bad idea. But I think that proves it by the way things are now, there's a load of fucking stupid arsed groups on Top of the Pops. What kind of an example is that to send to people? "I wanna be like a dancing clown". I think that's fucking stupid.

Can you settle people's minds and tell us how much you were paid off?
No, I reckon that is a private matter, but they paid me off alright. If I think about it for a year's work... I got two payments, I did alright out of it.

There's folklore that you went to a hotel room afterwards and just snorted it all up your nose.
I did a lot of drugs...

Kevin Mooney - Kevin & Jordan's weddingWas that a problem in the band? Did Adam know about it?
I wasn't doing drugs when I was in Adam & the Ants, except towards the end. I was really upfront about it. Adam asked if I was doing any 'gear', and I said, "yeah I am", and I didn't care. I continued to do a lot of drugs through the 1980s. I wouldn't recommend it to anybody else - I did waste a lot of money. Looking back, I wouldn't change anything but at the same time, I don't consider myself an advert for drugs.

You went through a particularly bad moment with Jordan...
We had the opposite; we had the good part of it. But when it started getting bad we stopped seeing each other. But it was good while it lasted.

You and Jordan formed Wide Boy Awake. Now tell us a bit about them...
We wanted to be like Milli Vanilli. I like people who can play instruments but I don't really like working with musicians, I'd much rather work with people who've got ideas. That's what Wide Boy Awake was. It was a bunch of nutty fellas that Jordan put together. None of us were really musicians, although we did play on all that stuff, but it was more from attitude. I think Slang Teacher is really fucking good, that's my own personal favourite that we did. But, if you look at video of Wide boy Awake it really is a bunch for deluded club-goers, being filmed by a record company who wanted them to look like Adam & the Ants or Spandau Ballet. And in that way we were as commercial and as crass and as pop as anybody else, but we were trying not to be, we were trying to provide people with a reggae-matic hip-hop mind of sounds then, which we did do I think a little bit. But people's perception of us was that we were another package - it was too corporate.

Kevin Mooney - Wide Boy AwakeDid you feel that you were under the shadow of Adam & the Ants?
Not in Max, but in Wide Boy Awake I did a little bit, because when they wrote about us they wrote about us in the same way. We were trying and failing to do something different to everybody else.

Did you feel you were too aggressive for the record companies?
Yeah. But you know what, a lot of people in record companies are fucking wankers. I've had a lot of dealings with a lot of major record companies since Adam & the Ants - RCA, Warner, ZTT, Chrysalis, Geffen, I've had deals with all of them and you know what, I just think they suck, the whole business. Everyone's supposed to sit there and go, "Thank you! Thank you to my A&R man!" but they haven't got a clue, and most of them, all they care about is whether they are going to lose their job. So at CBS for Adam & the Ants it worked fucking great. At many corporations it's an uphill struggle but I think that's about to change, because of Napster. They theoretically beat Napster, but I think the whole idea of getting music from the Internet is just going to blow all of those corporations out of the water eventually. It's good if you've got a little crew together and they're pushing something, and you've got your marketing man and your A&R man, that's fine, but it doesn't work like that nine times out of ten.

There's an interview with Jordan where she claims Adam tried to put the stop on CBS signing Wide Boy Awake...
But that's fair enough, who can blame him for that really?

Kevin Mooney - Wide Boy AwakeMaybe he saw you as a threat?
Maybe, but that's fair enough because I am a threat! I didn't feel too bad about that. We ended up with a deal anyway, so no harm was done.

What happened to the rest of Wide Boy Awake?
The only thing we got out of Wide Boy Awake was that song Slang Teacher. And a lot of people in America, that helped me later on in the States, they were doing remixes of that one little song, so that opened doors for me. I'm proud of it actually, it's pretty good. It's been covered a few times.

It's found itself on quite a few compilation albums actually. Were there any others in the band on was it just you and Jordan?
No, there was Lenny, who was a hairdresser, Horace, who played Percussion, Kelly, who played drums, John Keown, my best mate, he played bass. I played bass also - we had two bassists. We ripped off Adam & the Ants - they had two drummers, we had two bassists.

What happened to the rest of the band?
I think Kelly does reggae music, he's from Ladbroke Grove. Horace is a teacher somewhere in southeast London and a counsellor to youths. And John, dead. And Lenny, I've not seen.

Seeing as you wrote your own songs, did you ever feel like you could have approached Adam and Marco with them, or did you try?
I never tried, but a few years ago they did a couple of them, just after I left London, after John died. But I was a little bit pissed off about that actually because they put two songs on that album and I ended up getting a quarter of the publishing for those songs. It was like: Adam, Reynolds, Marco and me, and I thought that was really unfair because I wrote those songs myself without Reynolds, and all Adam and Marco did was the slightest little changes - I was pissed off about that. Kevin Mooney - MaxAnd the only time I knew about it was when I saw the songs on the record. But at the same time, at least they did the songs.

So, how did you get involved in the whole Wonderful project?
I didn't. I never... I wrote a few songs for Max just before I left London. And then they are calling me up in Florida a year later saying that they've done the songs. And then a year after that I look at it and see I've got a quarter of the publishing.

Was that through the connection with Marco? Because he was in Max...
I think they were working with Reynolds. Marco produced one Max album, but I don't know…

As far as fans are concerned it's like, "Oh Adam's talking to Kevin again!"
I had no idea. I was not involved in it in any way.

So they just covered your songs basically?
Yeah... I was living in America though when they were recording that, so maybe it could have transpired differently. Basically, all I knew about it was when I saw the CD, that was it.

And then they covered Shake Your Hips
I didn't know about that until you told me. I've never even heard that! That did piss me off a little bit because I wasn't even in the country and I was away. But I know one thing, if I was in the country there's no fucking way I would have given away 75% of the publishing rights. You know, who cares. I'm bitching now... They did make little changes, but I wrote more than 25% percent of those songs that's for sure, the choruses and verses were there... but made a few quid out of it... you know, I'm not complaining!!

Kevin Mooney - MaxYou're so mellow now! [laughter] Do you think old age has mellowed you out?
Yeah, I fucking hope so! I'm going to be 40 next year. I'm glad, and I think I deserve to be 40 next year.

You've probably done more in 39 years than most people have done in their lifetime! If Adam asked to work with you again what would you say?
I think what Adam should do if form a band, right, and I'm not taking the piss, called the 'Adam's Family' I think they should all wear black and they should all be really really terrifying and frightening. And I think he could probably do that, and I know he's got quite a dark imagination and I think that's what he should do. I think he should forget the thought of ever re-launching his pop career, and just make a really frightening band called Adam’s Family that play rock n' roll music in the traditional way!

Rock n' roll, not industrial?
Just a rock n' roll band like his Bazooka Joe days.

With Uncle Fester on guitar?
Uncle Fester on guitar, the monster from the pit on bass, just make it fucking scary, like Motorhead, only twice as fucking scary. That's my advice!

Would you get involved in that?!
I don't know. I've got my own things to do. But I hear he's sitting round the corner all depressed and my advice to Adam is just fight. Write a fucking song and get it in the charts and he can do that if he wants to do it.

Kevin Mooney - at home in Belsize Park 2001Do you think he should do the Here & Now tour?
Doesn't it involve bands like T'Pau and Haircut 100?

ABC.. China Crisis…
It's like... shove it up the arse ya know, it's not fucking worth it! Though I tell you one thing, I was living in Boston and about two years ago there was a fucking D**** D**** concert and I couldn't believe it, the whole thing was sold out. Thousands of people were there waving at D**** D**** and if they can do it anyone can. Didn't he do that Nine Inch Nails tour or something?

A couple of songs...
That was a good idea because Nine Inch Nails are a bit like Adam & the Ants. If you listen to their darkness... there are parallels to Downward Spiral and Dirk Wears White Sox.

Was there anything you learnt from Adam? Did he give you any kind of advice?
He did tell me that a pop song was 3 minutes 15 seconds, and that advice was really good. I've done a lot of longer mixes, but 3 minutes and 15 is a good time. I tell you what, I admire Adam, I do. He is a funny motherfucker, he is. He is good at dirty jokes, and his weird humour, and I love him for that. He's good, we used to like Lenny Bruce and shit like that.

No. A little paranoid, but I don't think he's morbid.

Kevin Mooney - with Madam Stan on Primrose Hill 2001Did you see any failings with Adam?
Everybody's got failings. I think the ones we've already mentioned, but that's only my opinion. Other people see it differently.

What do you think of Kings now? Are you proud of the album? How does it rate in your biographical discography?
I haven't really listened to Adam & the Ants since I left the band. But the other day Harley [Mooney’s business partner] purchased Dirk Wears White Sox and Kings of the Wild Frontier, and we listened to it, and yeah, I think the Kings album is really good. I prefer Dirk though!!

A massive thanx to Kevin for welcoming us into his home and taking care of us with his time, sense of humour and overall humility. Thanx to Steve Ant for providing the 'Boat Trip' scan, Skip Rat, David Mantell, Elias Gaskin and David Battams for providing questions and Big hugs to Chris C, and Rose at Ego for arranging contact.

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